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Volume 451 - You Can't Say We Never Tried 
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 April 12, 2001
 VCR Alert -
They say it's more playful than combative, but they also say Carville's presence reduces
 Mr. Know-It-All-O'Reilly to a decent human being because he knows Carville will nail his ass for lying.
 TONIGHT - Carville vs. O'Reilly - The Replay, on C-Span. Check your listings.

 Update - Several people have written to say this "debate" is very friendly, and that both sides
 got very polite and respectful, which isn't bad in of itself, but I really hate it when these "mad dog"
 Freepers like O'Reilly get all polite when there's a liberal who can defend himself nearby.


Subject: Remember When We Had a Real President?

We used to have a President who was the MASTER of diplomacy.  He could make an apology and
half the people thought it was sincere and the other half would say it wasn't even an apology.

And he could make his split-hairs apology in such a way that HE took all the criticism from
those he  failed to please.  The world understood that if anyone lost face, it was him, not America.

The world could sometimes even laugh at him and his apologies, but that didn't mean they lost respect
for America.  HE took the heat, HE took the criticism, and HE took the embarrassment, all the while
the people who hated him said he couldn't stand up and take it like a man.

If this China incident happened when Bill Clinton was president, he would have suffered minor indignities
himself in order to preserve international respect for America and to gain the freedom of our service members.

W. is willing to let our service members be held and the world to question
our judgment in order to maintain his own reputation.

Clinton was selfless in these situations; W. is a spoiled baby who's going
to need his daddy to go to the neighbor's house to get the ball back.

 Smirky Wows 'em at the White House

 As seen by The Onion


Subject: Re: Exhibit B

Dear Mr Cop,

I suspect you're not going to listen to a rational argument but...

You say IF Dateline did a hatchet job on Bush then everyone you could think of would denounce it.
This is then followed with, "When those 38 people attack Clinton and his cock, who does the rebuttal?"

Now, surely the point is that if Dateline fabricated a story about Bush there would be something to defend,
but the allegations about Clinton were true, therefore there was nothing TO defend.

I know being a liberal means turning off the logic but come on! ;-)

Yours, with love,

Simon, that's very weak.
Had you been at the last debate (partial transcripts available) you would've seen
the last guy to shoot his mouth off about "all Clinton's crimes," get his ass whooped.

When pinned down, the only "crime" he could come up with was Webster Hubbell,
who was convicted of stealing from the Clintons.

I know you non-logic types love to say "Filegate" was a crime, and "Travelgate" was a crime,
and "Vince Foster" was a murder, but Kenneth Starr says you're dead wrong.

Do me a favor:
Get the five smartest people you know in a room a week from tonight.
I'll debate your team while doing shots of tequila.



Subject: Reagan

Reagan visited SS graves, to boot.
The SS ran the death camps.

Let's make room on Mt. Rushmore for this guy!


Sean, at least one of us is confused.

This picture is of Reagan saluting Nazi graves at Bitburg, Germany.
His handlers told him, "Don't do it, don't you dare," but that senile old bastard
was going to heap praise on those Nazi bastard killers and nobody could talk him out of it.

From: (withheld)

Subject: China

Bart as much as I hate Smirk, and think he is a disaster as president,
why the macho bullshit that America should never apologize?

I never said "America should never apologize."
I said we shouldn't apologize when we're innocent.

Why won't american's ever believe we could be in the wrong?
As far as that guy who called Limbaugh saying he'd rather rot in a Chinese prison
than have the U.S. apologize, well he's an idiot and it's easy to say that and posture
when you're not actually in that situation.

I'll bet he'd feel differently if he were actually held captive.
Anyway if it were me or a member of my family I'd want the U.S. to apologize.
Screw national pride or any of that macho crap.
Aren't lives more important than saving face?

I guess it's a guy thing because I sure don't understand the attitude.
What did we lose by apologizing?
I love your site and I agree with you most of the time.

What we have done is tell the entire world that if you want America to dance,
just grab a hostage and tell us what dance you want to see us do.

I've been offering examples, such as in war, if the enemy says,
"Stop bombing or we'll execute the POWs we've taken," we have to say
"Do what you gotta do," because we can't let another nation call the tune.

Let me offer a flawed analogy: If a cop pulls over a bad guy and the bad guy says,
"You stupid pig, if you write that ticket, I'll find your house and kill your kids,"
should the cop still write the ticket?

After all, he's endangering his kids, right?
Shouldn't the cop back down, apologize, and let the bad guy drive away?
That's what Smirk just did - he let the bad guy drive away

If that scenario was on TV, the whole world will know you can beat up the cops.
All you gotta do is threaten their kids, and now there's no more laws in America.

Remember the Andy Griffith when the fruit stand burlyboys set up near town?
Barney told them to move on, but they just laughed at him.
It became a showdown between the law and lawlessness.

Using your example, it's only fruit, right?  Why take a stand?
But when they tell their buddies you can break laws in Mayberry, because all you
gotta do is push the skinny cop and he'll run, then we have chaos.

That's what Smirk did - he turned tail and ran.
Now other countries know Smirk is a big pussy, and America, too.

This is much, much, much, much worse than losing 24 lives.

I am not wrong on this.

 Doesn't it Figure?

 When the "crisis" was Clinton's cock, it was every American's "right to know."

 But when President Weak and Stupid presides over this massive technology transfer
 to the Chi-Comms, Rush, Hannity, Smirky and the media are allllllllllllllllllllllllllll
 trying to sell us the idea of how we actually won this stand-off and everything's OK?

 That's horseshit!

 Handing a sophisticated plane from the future to the enemyhas to be 10,000 times
 more important than Clinton's cock, but now we're supposed to forgive and forget?


 Hannity, subbing for the vulgar Pigboy just said,

 "China got NOTHING out of this, absolutely NOTHING!"

 It's almost like he's ...lying.


Subject: But...but...but


I'm with you about 99% of the time, but I think you came down too hard on Vivian when you said:
"They were fighting a war, and they are soldiers - some of our best. "

Truth is, there is no war, except the one that Smirky et al. are trying to conjur up as a pretext
for vast increases in the military budget and a blank check for the absurd Missile Defense.

They *need* an enemy, and the whole Repugnican Party has been casting around for one since
the collapse of the Soviet bloc. The rest of us most definitely do not need an enemy, and we most
definitely do not need a return to the Cold War mentality. And these spy flights are a Cold War relic
that ought to be stopped. As others have pointed out, any intelligence the flights gather can be
(and is) also obtained by other means. They are a high-risk, low-reward deal.


Sure, there's some semantics, but IF we were just "flying by, minding our own business,"
The way President Weak and Stupid claims we were, and China sent their military planes
to knock us out of the sky for no reason, by Koresh, that's a act of war.

And let me tell you something about Vivian. She wrote:
Maybe you'd rather rot in a Chinese prison than have your country apologize
to ensure your return. But that'd be stupid.

As a rule, when somebody comes at me with a personal attack, I tend to launch.
Matter of fact I did, but before I hit "send," I scaled it back some.


Subject: What the Chinese got

The answer to what the Chinese wanted and got is easy.
They were worried about Taiwan getting Aegis warships,
Smirk need to sell them to satisfy his defense contractor buddies,
easy way out, give the Chinese the means to defeat Aegis targeting.

The "spy plane" had the planets most advanced electronic counter-measures technologies.
Problem solved, everyone (except the people) get what they want.


Leon, good point. Last night on Larry King, I heard some total moron from
the Brookings Institute claim this was a "win-win" situation for both countries.

Let's see:
They got our technology,
our plane jammed with futuristic machinery,
interviews with the xperts who know how to run the equipment
and an apology from President Weak and Stupid.

Yeah, that's a BIG win for us.


Subject: California Weed

In November, voters in Mendocino County north of San Francisco
approved the growing of up to 25 marijuana plants per person.
By December, northern California was having severe electricity shortages.

I think not!


 Jobless Claims Highest in Nearly 5 Years

 Full Sad Story

 Whore City - The number of Americans seeking first-time unemployment benefits last week
 reached its highest level in five years, the government said on Thursday in a report showing
 weakening in the U.S. labor market as the world's richest economy staggers.

 No shock there.
 President Weak and Stupid is running the economy.
 We're now of the oil companies, by the oil companies and for the oil companies.

 Screw what his energy policies are doing to millions of American families.
 His oil buddies need more billions, and they're not enjoying the wait.


Subject: The Heroes

I've been admiring your site from afar and decided to get something off my chest.
The 24 people who donated that spy plane to China are no more heroes than the
three "heroes" who were captured "prisoners of war" in Bosnia a few years back.

They got lost hiking, and got snatched, and the EMC2P41blah blah-flying flop
couldn't spy without getting knocked out of the sky.

I understand what you're saying, but I'll give the bene of the doubt to anyone
who puts on the uniform. Right now it appears the 24 screwed up.
Once they're back on land, we'll have more facts, but maybe not the truth.

Those men and women, who signed up for military service know full well there were risks,
and should have ditched that plane in the South China Sea and taken their chances.
Real spies should have cyanide tablets in their flight suits so they can do the honorable thing.
I don't care that Bush kow-towed (remember that one?) to China, he's a stupid fuck.
I don't like the fact that trained military soldiers, including a Fightin' Texas Aggie, gave the
Chinese more secrets than Clinton could have given if all the accusations from the cretins
on the right were accurate.

Dr. Bill

It seems certain President Weak and Stupid is guilty.
The 24 on the plane I'm not sure about.
If America had a press,
we'd know in a few days,
but we don't,
so we won't.


Subject: Fw: Bush "diplomacy" in 6 easy GOP Steps

 1. Act Mad
 2. Talk tough
 3. Sabre rattle
 4. Make threats

Bush must make Republicans proud the way he sells out the nation to communists.

Remember,  the GOP said there was "no reason" for the president to have a brain
because he'd be surrounded by people with brains.

Never trust a wartime deserter.

 The Angie Harmon Situation

 Remember when Law & Order started?
 Sure, the stories were good, but it was Jill Hennesey who caught my eye.

 Pretty hot babe, eh?
 But then Jill left the show.
 Who, I thought, could they get to replace this fabulous babe?

 Well, they went and found an even hotter babe - a Bond girl - Carey Lowell.


 I'd pay $200 just to get Miranda from Carey Lowell.
 (I had to crop the picture short so as not to show her breast.
  Koresh knows us liberal Democrats can't stand the sight of the female form...)

 But, like Jill Hennesey, she wanted to move on.
 I knew it would be really tough to replace Carey Lowell.
 Who could be mas fina than Carey Lowell?

 They found 'em a Dallas girl - Angie Harmon.

 The Queen of Depraved Indifference!

 But, now Angie is leaving the show, too.

 They replaced Jill with an even hotter Carey.
 They replaced Carey with an even hotter Angie.
 Holy Koresh!
 Can my heart take a legal babe hotter than Angie Harmon?


As I write this, I am listening to Condo-lee-za Rice talking to Katy on
the NBC morning program about subject A. Katy was nailing her about the
apology and Rice tells her that "it is over now and we will put it behind us."

Well! Gee! Golly!
Why didn't the Repubs let Clinton say that about the Monica affair?



Subject: Cincinatti riots?!

While the domestic papers are trumpeting how Bush has damn near
saved the world with his dipwit handling of the China/plane "incident,"
there's been almost discussion of how Cincinatti is in flames.

Resident Bush: Saving the world while trashing America.


Serdar, always good to hear from you!


Subject: You forgot somebody!

Okay, so you thanked Sally Fields, which is good. But you left out Tammy over at the BBBR.
You've featured some of her graphics, and they're really, really GOOD.
Please, the next time you win an award, don't forget Tammy!

Also, on the China thing. I'm with you.
We shouldn't have apologized even if it WAS our fault.
I've been wondering for some time about the "warm-fuzzying" of our military.
Nobody is forced to join, and they explain the rules when you sign up.
I'll bet that landing that plane ANYWHERE was in direct violation of standing orders.
They were supposed to go down with the plane.
Yellow ribbons and teddy bears are nice and cute, but they don't win wars.
And they make your dick look limp.

Keep up the EXCELLENT work!

Anne, I'm all for apologizing if we were in the wrong, but President Weak and Stupid
says that's not the case. He says our plane was hijacked, then apologized to the hijacker.

Never trust a wartime deserter.

Carefully read the following news release describing the meat of the US apology :

  '' The first draft of a U.S. letter included the word "regret," but the Chinese wanted more, said the official.
     By last Thursday evening Washington time, the word "sorry" was added to the letter, and by Saturday evening
     Washington time, the words "very sorry" were added.

  '' The administration, in the letter presented to the Chinese Wednesday, said it was "very sorry" about the
     loss of life in the collision, and "very sorry" the plane entered Chinese airspace and landed on Chinese
     territory without "verbal clearance." ''

What is being spun by the Whitehouse and the whore press is that the US apologized for two things :

 1) the loss of life of the Chinese pilot
 2) that the EP-3 entered Chinese airspace to make an emergency landing

     But, the actual wording apologizes for _three_ separate items :

 1) the loss of life of the Chinese pilot
 2) that the EP-3 entered Chinese airspace
 3) that the EP-3 made an emergency landing without clearance

Also to be noted, the wording, as expressed in Chinese, is not "very" sorry, it is "double sorry."
In cultural context, double sorry implies expressing sorrow for a personal transgression
committed against the party being apologized to.

The English transition being reported implies we have apologized for nothing (especially as being spun
by the Whitehouse and lapped up by the press like pigboy at a slop trough).  The actual Chinese version
of the wording acknowledges an American transgression and expresses contrition at having committed
an offense against the Chinese people.

  -- popabear


Subject: AIR RULES

    Since I served in the Army Air Corps in WW11 until today, any time a
plane with mechanical trouble or due to a flight plan change wanted to land at
any air field we were required to call the field and request permission to land.

     Because of many interfering conditions which the pilots have no knowledge of,
permission from the tower to land was required. Some times if the request was not
an emergency, permission was denied for reasons unknown to the pilot.

    The pilot was then either put in a holding pattern to land later or directed to another airfield.
Even though our plane was in an emergency condition, the pilot still should have called the
airfield telling them that they had an emergency and asked permission for an emergency landing.

    I'm glad that it's almost over now that our troops are on their way to US soil.
But we should still acknowledge the rules of the air, which I feel applies even to Communist countries.


 ha ha



 Right now, I have less than one working computer between home and work.
 My work compouter can do everything but post to the Internet, and my home computer
 is really fried, but it can post, so the juggle is at an all-time maddening peak.

 If you sent mail disagreeing with this China thing, please re-send.
 Last night I forwarded the 16 most critical letters to work, to print, but they didn't arrive.
 Also, my position on this Smirk grovelling isn't designed to provoke,
 but I'd enjoy defending my position, so if you disagree - let's get it on.

 By Janet Reno, Attorney General 1993-2001 as told to Larry McNichol, investigative reporter

 Click  Here


Subject: Through the Fucking Looking Glass

Remember during the 2000 campaign, when Smirk started to use the work of the whore media against Gore?
Remember the hack, assinine media repeating the "Buddhist Temple," "Love Canal," "Love Story," and
"I invented the internet" lies to smear Al Gore?

Remember The Eventual Usurper saying  we need "plain speaking in the White House?"
You can't get plain speaking out of The Usurper.  Period.
And the whore media will never ask him if he ever intends to speak "plainly."

That question is not in the script.
End of story.


 Ton o Mail and Toons

 Click  Here


Subject: see you later

I have enjoyed your website for several months now, but I *completely*
disagree with your macho ego trip that the U.S. shouldn't apologize to China.
We owe apologies to the WHOLE WORLD.

According to an item in the Italian press, both countries are using this
"incident" to their advantage.  You've falling into the trap.

Maybe you'd rather rot in a Chinese prison than have your country apologize to ensure your return.
But that'd be stupid.

a committed pacifist

Those 24 people wren't high school kids being held by a deranged NRA member.
They were fighting a war, and they are soldiers - some of our best.

The reason the men and women of military are so respected is they have made the decision
and the committment to put their life on the line. They are fighting for their country.

Remember World War II?
What if Japan threatened to kill a POW if we continued bombing Tokyo?
Should we have turned tail and ran?
Is that one life worth more than the entire war?
Should we have "forgotten" about Pearl Harbor to save one life?

Don't you think the thousands of men who have died for their country would
"rather" be alive, with their families? That's almost insulting, the way you put that.
It's easy to be a pacifist when someone else is dying to keep you safe.


Subject: Where do you get those hilarious covers?

The Weakly World News,
I mean.... ha ha ha ha ha

The regular Weekly World News supermarket rag is funny anyways...
When I had my anti-inauguration party on 20 Jan 2001,
one of my guests brought along copies as party favors... ha ha

So, come on, give up your source...
I got local Repubikkkans that need harrassin'.


The Weakly World News is done by a fella named "Chris."
When he sees this, Chris might forward to me permission to release his name and e-mail.
I think he's the best that there is at what he does.

Y'know, if I ever get interviewed again, I hope the fella asks,
"In what ways have you been really lucky on your web site?" to which I'd say,

"I have met some of the best graphic people and photo toon people and cartoonists."

 For instance, Kevin Cunningham does the best photo toons.
 The Wizard of Whimsy does the best taunt toons.
 Jenny Q can take an idea for an ani-gif and make it better than the original idea. has been doing the greatest Tort-Smirk headline toons for what, 6 months or more?
 CBIX does great graphic work, he did those great "Hammer" grafs.
 Wolf Grulkey does the best straight editorial cartoons of anyone I know.
 MoPaul has done some home run hitting in straight eddys, too.
 And a Tip O' the Hat to The YeesterBunny, who's been sending me
 10 good political cartoons a day from various newspapers and magazines.

 I feel like Sally Field, ...I'm forgetting who to thank.
 In the last 20 months, dozens of talented people have submitted great stuff,
 and if I published you and didn't mention you, lemme know.

 Koresh's truth be known,  wouldn't be half the fun without the toons.
 Toons and graphics can take a thousand word rant and reduce it to a single thought.
 My fellow writer Billy S said, "A picture is worth a thousand words."

 Hats off to the gifted part of the BartCop team - the graf/toon artists.

 A Shot of Chinaco to the talent!

 By the way, you asked about the Weakly World News?

 Toon by


The thieves in office have done a real snow job on the general public for
these lo many years, accusing the press and media of being liberal...ha, ha, ha.

Only morons like the one who illegally sits in the commander in thief chair,
would ever buy such crap. Had this China thing happened with Clinton in office,
you can just imagine how it would be spread over every newpaper, magazine,
tv talk slop show, that it was ALL CLINTON'S Fault.

What a joke our government is and how dangerous it is for
caring citizens who have no voice.


Harriet Robertson,
Port Richey, Fl.

 Read the  Previous Issue

 It had everything.

 Copyright © 2001,
   Thanks for the fumble, Dude.

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